How to remove rocking as a prop?

[Jmb2008]

I take that back. When she was finally ready to go to sleep it took four min of patting. Amazing. 

And I forgot to say that last night was a new record. 8:00-5:15!!!!! Then I gave her some milk in a cup as she would not settle (I have decided to stop bf at night in case that is what she's waking for. She has gone without a feed a night before so I know she doesn't always need it). Then I had to rock her to sleep. Down 6:10-7:30.

This is working!!!! 

[katie80]

Great update!   Well done!

To get rid of the final patting, you'll just need to stop a bit sooner every couple nights.  Say your sleepy phrase when you lay her down, pat her for a bit, and then slow it down and just hold a hand on her.  If she protests, you can pat a bit more, but slow down and stop again before she's asleep.  Continue to pull back sooner and sooner and use your sleepy phrase to help her know she needs to settle. 

[Jmb2008]

Update: nights were getting worse, then I noticed she was teething. So I have given her Advil before bed the last few nights and she's back to 7-9 hours at the beginning of the night.  Yay .  Still working on removal of patting to sleep. But after that usually nothing good happens.  And I don't know what to do. I don't really get to sleep much from about 4-7.

Is it because the medicine has worn off and the teething is bugging her?  I am trying to not bf her till 7, but it's happened at 6 a few times.  She will accept milk in a cup but will only ever drink a few oz so I'm not convinced hunger is the problem   Or is she still just wanting to bf?  This morning when she woke at 5:30 (second time) she screamed for 40 min, would start to settle then scream again.  I gave up at 6 because dh wasn't going to help and I took her to bed with me.  She slept till after 8:30.   I had given her milk at the first wake up at 3:00 but she wanted nothing to do with it then.

Why would she do such a good stretch and then everything fall apart???
What am I doing wrong?

[katie80]

(((Hugs))), you aren't doing anything wrong!   That sounds *totally* normal for nighttime sleep and teething.  The medicine has worn off, and at 4am she enters a lighter stage of sleep, so is likely to notice the discomfort more.  My DS is cutting his top two molars ATM, and we're in the exact same place wrt 4-7am.  You could give her meds if she wakes around 3am, or even go in and give them as a dream med, if she doesn't wake around that time in order to keep the pain minimized until morning.  I'm guessing she probably isn't hungry, but more wanting the comfort of BF when she wakes in the wee hours. 

It's fine to keep up with the patting while she's teething, as they can need a little more help while they're in discomfort. She's shown you that she has the capability of sleeping a nice, long stretch for you, so it should be a bit easier to get rid of the patting once she's not bothered by the teeth.

[Jmb2008]

Thank you for your support and advice, we wouldn't be this far without it

So, the last 3 nights she's more or less put herself to sleep! Yay! Tonight she was flopping herself back down after sitting up when I said her sleepy phrase.  Lol

5/5:30 seems to be her set time to wake up.  So close to morning!  Middle of the night wakings I would say are getting better. I don't think I've rocked her to sleep for awhile.  She'll settle in her crib (sometimes with a lot of ssh pat) pretty good.  But I am still picking her up to calm, and give milk if close to am. Though she only drinks a few oz. so I'm not sure she needs it but it let's her know that's all she's getting anyway.

Those teeth are taking their sweet time coming in! I want to see what he can do without that pain!

Looking back we have come so far, I keep telling myself to be patient and that she's doing good.  But I want that 11-12 hours solid!!!

[katie80]

Thank you for your support and advice, we wouldn't be this far without it

You're welcome! You've really come a long way since you first posted on the NW board!

I keep telling myself to be patient and that she's doing good.  But I want that 11-12 hours solid!!!

Yes, I want it too, LOL.  She is doing great, teeth really can be a bugger, esp for EW.  Another option is to look at routine, as that can play a factor in EW as well.  Keep up your patience and it will come.

[Jmb2008]

Can teething last two weeks?  Only one has come through but her nights are a disaster again.  Even with Advil.   Last night I was up 4 times with her, staying from 4-6:45 next to her crib patting on and off a lot!  Then to bed with me to nurse but was done sleeping. She went to sleep at 8 last night.  The only silver lining is I didn't have to nurse or rock her to sleep once.  She's still letting me put her down with ssh-pat after i settle her-she wakes screaming.  But she was so unsettled in her crib.

Should I head to the routine board?  I don't know what to do.

[katie80]

Can teething last two weeks?

Yes, unfortunately some LOs are slower teethers.  What teeth are they?  My DS has been working on his top two molars for a month now, most of the points are through, but that's it, the rest of the tooth still has to come.

What you describe sounds like discomfort and maybe a bit of OT as well.  You can sure post your routine here and I'll take a look or you can post on the Toddler Sleep board for more specific help (she's over 1yr now, correct?).

[Jmb2008]

Yes, she is one now. 

Oy, a month!  So do you do medicine every night for that long? The tooth to the right of her bottom front teeth is the only one that has made an appearance.  I keep checking as she lets me but I still see no signs of the other one or the top ones which I believe are next.

Yes, there is definitely some over tiredness at play here too.  It feels like a bit of a vicious cycle between the teething and switching between one and two nap days, NW, and EW....  We seem to have caught up on some sleep here the last couple of days though.  The last two nights she has been a lot more settled and only 3 wake ups. Last night was asleep by 8, and today she actually stayed till 7 in her crib.  Yay.  It's been awhile....

She seems to be able to do 5 hours easily before a nap in the am but it does take a bit to settle her.  Does that mean she's been up too long?  But she'll usually only stay down 1.25-1.5 hours for a nap after that. And then thes not really time for a catnap.  It's so tricky now that she'll just keep playing to see when to put her down. 

So today:
Wake at 7
Bf (she may have snoozed for a few min while nursing in bed with me)
8:30 breakfast
11:00 lunch then milk
Nap 12:00-1:20
Snack
4:00 bf
Supper
I plan on having her in bed at 7:00, hopefully sleeping by 7:30

[Jmb2008]

I put her down at 7:15, she freaked out, so I gave her some milk since she didn't bf very long.   Put her down at 7:30 and she was asleep in 10-15 min.

[Jmb2008]

So here's our horrible night:
10:20 cried out but settled
11:45 screamed till I gave her milk -I left at 12:20
12:45? picked up for couple min, not happy about something but settled in crib with less patting - I left at 1:20
1:25 no pick up? Little pat - left at 1:35
4:30 cried out?
4:55 little drink of milk - settled with less patting than usual - I left at 5:30
6:30 I took her to bed with me. She bf then at 7:00 rolled over to sleep till 7:30.

She woke happy.  At least one of us is ready for today.....

I never gave her medicine last night.  Even though she woke a gazillion times she was pretty settled in her crib when I put her down.  So why???  Ugh.

[katie80]

I think she's OT.  The teeth might be playing a factor, but all those wakes early in the night suggest OT.  And, in the move to one nap, typically anything less than 2hr is going to make it difficult to get through the day.  I think she's doing a bit of an OT nap and then the afternoon just gets too long.

You mentioned it was taking her a bit longer to settle at 5hr A.  Have you tried to get her in there 10-15min earlier to see if that makes a difference in settling or nap length?  As it stands from your EASY yesterday, I'd try to have her sleeping at 6:30 pm (7 pm at the latest) and see if that doesn't help the unsettledness at night.  Early bedtimes are usually the best way to go in these transitions when there's not enough time for a CN.

Oy, a month!  So do you do medicine every night for that long? The tooth to the right of her bottom front teeth is the only one that has made an appearance.  I keep checking as she lets me but I still see no signs of the other one or the top ones which I believe are next.

Yes, a month. . I typically switch between 3 nights of acetaminophen and then 3 nights of ibuprofen and then try to take a couple off if things aren't too bad. Is not ideal, but I did the same thing with my DD and then once she hit 2.5 and all her teeth were in, she's only had about 3 full doses of medicine, so it all evens out (at least I tell myself). And FWIW, teeth don't always play by the rules. . My DD got her molars when she only had the front four (no latereal incisors in sight) and my DS go his upper lateral incisors before the middle ones.