11 week old nap and now nighttime sleep issues!

[sparklewings1984]

I'm thinking try keeping his first A time at 1hr 35 for another 2 days to see if he gets used to it? Also just a bit more info, when I heard him stir at the 40 min mark it was just a kind of sigh noise like he probably turned his head and dozed off again. But then at 50 mins he just starts full on crying immediately. I leave him maybe 20 seconds in case it is a dream cry but then go straight into him and calm him in the crib but he usually stops crying for a few seconds and starts up again. Even when I picked him up and rocked him he wouldn't settle so ended up just getting him up and starting A time from there.

Can I also ask advice about the wind down again? So I am now laying him in the cot after 1hr 15 mins and playing with his cuddly toys for 10 mins in the cot. Then pop his arms and legs into his pramsuit (which he had been lying on in the cot) and then close the blind and settle him. He normally has started fussing before I put him in the pramsuit, and then starts crying once I start putting his arms and legs into it and closing the blind. 

Am I waiting too long?  Should I put him in the pram suit as soon as I lay him in the cot and then play with his cuddly toys? Then as soon as he fusses close the blind and settle him?

He only cries for maybe 2 or 3 mins when I am settling him but he always seems to get angry and is pushing himself up the cot with his legs and trying to grab with his arms.

[Ima shel Alon]

I am glad you made some progress

A 50min nap is for most babies an Ut nap. He has been a while now on 1:35h A time, no? If he did then I would consider actually increasing this A time by 10min instead of waiting with it for a few more days. But if it's only a couple of days with this A time then I would wait couple more days.

There is no right and wrong with WD. It sound to me like you are doing great, actually. 2-3min settling time is nothing! I had to sit ages with DS... If you think that a slight change can help him be less fussy then you can just try it out, though like I said, 2-3min is really good. Almost all babies this age still need a bit of time to settling.

[sparklewings1984]

Yes he has been on 1hr 30-1hr 35 for about 1 week now. He is now nearly 16 weeks old  (12 weeks corrected) so I think he probably is ready to increase, especially after getting some great sleep at night  (last night he slept 8.15pm-2.30am fed, woke at 4.30am and needed settling after he only bf for 2 mins so wasn't hungry, then slept until 6.40am, woohoo!).

This morning I tried 1hr 45 mins A time. Before I put him in the cot he had cried out a little like he was in pain and I had given him some teething granules. He cried for 2/3 mins again when I started settling him and was asleep at 1hr 45. He woke 22 mins later with slow cries, ie not his urgent cry. I went in after 30 seconds or so. He was wide awake and stopped crying when he was chomping on my finger. I thought this short nap was teething related? He chewed my finger for a few minutes and then was babbling away and quite happy so I got him out of his cot a few mins later.

I'll try 1hr 45 again tomorrow and just keep at it! Yesterday I got 2 short naps in his cot in the morning (50min and 25 min which I thought were  UT and then OT) and then 1hr 25 and 2 hrs in his pram when I took him out for walks in the afternoon. He was such a happy baby with more sleep and the teething granules calming him down!

[Ima shel Alon]

It does take a few days for them to get used to new A times so I would stick with it for a few more days before we make any conclusion.

[sparklewings1984]

So today... we had a great first nap. Hurray!!!!

He WU at 7.20am so I was aiming for 1hr 45 mins again but in the end he was falling asleep in the cot and it was 1hr 40 mins of A time. I tried a new tactic as I was trying to keep him awake a few more mins and just carried on wriggling the cuddly toy on the side of the cot, and that is how he fell asleep with no real crying abs just a bit of moaning. I then fully closed the blind as it had been open a crack at that point and left him. He slept 1hr 15 mins!  Woohoo!!!!

Then tried 1hr 45 for his next nap and the same routine but he did end up crying a little bit this time. He only slept 25 mins.

Third nap was in the pram but we went out after 1hr 35 A time and he stayed awake 10 mins so 1hr 45 A before he fell asleep.

Final nap was a catnap in my arms and just doing BT now.

Any thoughts on the second nap or is it too early to tell?

[Ima shel Alon]

I would keep on doing what you are doing, but if after two more days you are getting a 25min nap for the second nap then I will go back to 1:35h A time just for that A time and see if it helps.

[sparklewings1984]

Well disaster has struck just as we were getting into things. LO has caught my cough and cold

We had hardly any sleep last night and I ended up putting him into bed with me at 6am for side by side nursing and we both managed to doze for a couple of hours.

So I guess we just have to get through this before we start up again? Poor little guy was waking up every sleep cycle coughing and snorting.

[ZacsMumme]

yes you just have to battle through illness then pick up where you left off after. Hugs

[sparklewings1984]

We are having an absolute nightmare with this cold

3 nights of hardly any sleep for me,  and barely enough for LO. He is waking almost every sleep cycle or 2, the most sleep I have had is 1 hour uninterrupted. In the morning I have been trying to get him to sleep in later as he is still soooo tired at the usual 7am WU. He doesn't seem to want to sleep though but then starts acting OT after a really short time and screaming and crying.

Obviously whilst he is ill APOP is in play but is there any limit to how much APOP I should do? I've been resorting up cuddling him to sleep during the night just so that he actually gets some sleep. He usually self settles 90% of the time at night so this is really unusual for him,  poor little guy.

I'm just conscious of making bad habits now, any tips on where to draw the line? I'm just doing my best to get him as much sleep as possible during the day to catch up on his lost night sleep. I am so tired myself though but I've managed 2 pram walks per day and then I just feel too tired to do any more. I got my mum to help today but she lives 2 hours drive away so this is a one off.

[Ima shel Alon]

You can't do much other than offer as much sleep as possible during the day, even if you don't really pay attention to A times. I would try not to resort to AP as such, but settling only in his cot. Be there for him more than you usually are, but I would try avoiding taking him into bed with you or holding for long times.
Hope he feels better soon and you can all get some sleep.

[sparklewings1984]

Ok his cold is gone,  we have had 3 decent nights of sleep with only 2 feeds between 8pm BT and 7am WU each night so I'm happy with that. LO does still have a bit of a cough but nothing that is affecting his sleep.

Quick question, I tried him back on 1hr 45 A time for his first nap and the past 2 days he seems to have been OT by this point. Am I right in thinking that this illness may have zapped his energy and he is still catching up on some sleep? I was thinking of reducing his A time back to 1hr 35 for a few days to see if that helps,  WWYD?

[Ima shel Alon]

Am I right in thinking that this illness may have zapped his energy and he is still catching up on some sleep? I was thinking of reducing his A time back to 1hr 35 for a few days to see if that helps,  WWYD?

Yes, I think the same like you. I would reduce A time again.

[sparklewings1984]

I feel like we are going backwards

Now when I lay him down for his nap he is REALLY crying every time. I am doing my best to soothe him in the cot but he gets so worked up that I have had to PU and calm him.

I can't tell if it is still that the A time is too long after his illness. This morning he yawned after 1hr but I kept him awake. He started to be fussy around 1hr 10 so I walked around carrying him as this calmed him down but then by 1hr 20 his eyes were closing so I rushed to the nursery to try and put him down. 20 mins of screaming followed and he had just woken after 5 minutes!

He basically seems to only want to nurse to sleep which I don't want to get into the habit of. This morning for example, he had just woken from a really good night of sleep. Fed at 7.15pm, down for the night at 8.15pm. Woke for a feed at 2am and straight back to sleep, then woke for a feed at 6am so I treated that as WU and turned the lights on etc.

So that first nap I knew he wasn't hungry as he had a full feed at 6am and was being put down at 7.20am. The screaming went on for 20 mins and then he woke at 7.45am screaming. PU after he wouldn't calm down. Ended up taking him back into my bedroom because I don't want him to get OT so am now sat holding him asleep and he was nuzzling at my boob. I know he only wants to comfort suck to sleep so did not give him the boob and he has now fallen asleep in my arms.

I don't know what to do now...This is totally different to the 2 solid weeks we had at the start of Jan when he was going to sleep with only 2-3 mins of mild fussing. Then my only problem was the 40 min naps!

Is this just the after effects of him being ill? Should I post on the getting back on track board? I feel like that is a bit cheeky as we were never "on track" in the first place! Should I try laying him down in the cot MUCH MUCH earlier and playing with him there? Do you think he could just have been OT even at 1hr 20? Before he was ill I was laying him in the cot at around 1hr 30min and that was before his first yawn even. Maybe I should try 1hr into the cot for wind down playing with the cuddly toys and see when he starts to get sleepy?

[Ima shel Alon]

I don't know what to do now...This is totally different to the 2 solid weeks we had at the start of Jan when he was going to sleep with only 2-3 mins of mild fussing. Then my only problem was the 40 min naps!

Once they are ill, teething, going through developmental changes - everything is out the window. It really feels like starting all over again with ST and in a way it is, but the only difference is that usually the second time around (or the third or the fourth) is quicker.
But everytime you are going to give in and feed to sleep, hold him to sleep, no matter what - this is going to throw you 10 steps backwards and the ST is going to get harder and harder.
I am sorry, this is probably not what you want to hear. There is no magic solution.
And you did already see a lot of progress, despite the 40min naps, so you know that when you are consistent then things are working.

Is he not well yet? I would actually start again and push A times. 1:10 for 3 days, then 1:20 for 3 days, then 1:30, and see where you are at.

[sparklewings1984]

Well I have no idea what is going on but I have an inconsolable baby most of the time now. I think he is chronically OT and suffering from horrendous trapped wind all day. I can't ST him because I can't tell when he is crying from pain now so I just always assume he needs me and PU.

One thing I'm thinking might have caused this is that when I had a cold I think my milk supply was suffering and so LO was nursing a lot. Now that I am better I think I might have an oversupply which has brought back my forceful letdown that he is struggling with again. I am using gas drops and also trying a dairy free diet to see if that helps.

I'm feeling exhausted again from all the crying, holding and pram walking. It feels like when he was 11 weeks old again,  I thought things were supposed to get easier