Exhausted mum needs helps with 8month old 1-2 hr NWs

[trimbler]

So glad that tooth is finally through hope its partner isn't far behind... And yay for the move, would be great if it did make a difference in you not disturbing each other so much - we can hope, anyway

[Atomic1010]

Well although lo was quite happy with the move he did disturb his older brother and given we are going to be st which involves crying we decided to move him back into our bedroom yesterday. 

Last night was strange. He woke every hour..I managed to feed him just twice in line with what I want to do with night weaning and only twice was he crying so much I needed to do PU/Pd, which surprisingly didnt take too long.  I mainly settled him in the cot by shh pat as I think im supposed to do that first.

I think the other tooth must be upsetting him as settling at BT most nights this week has been dreadful and he has kept waking up every 10-30 mins v upset. Ive been giving him calpol last couple of nights, which has helped a little but not eliminated the problem.

[trimbler]

Aw poor thing - I hate teething! I mean, those teeth do come in handy and all that, but the process isn't much fun, is it? I hadn't realised you were moving him in with older brother - we still haven't been brave enough to do that so our DD is still in with us at almost 20mo Teething's horrible here too...

Sounds like you did really well last night despite having all those wakings to contend with, you must be tired though Yes it sounds like you did just right, always start with shh pat if it helps (doesn't always at this age, but you could use a variation) and use PUPD if needed. Great to hear that it didn't take as long as you'd feared

Don't forget to post the day's EASY when you get the chance

[Atomic1010]

I agree! I think it would be better if babies were born with teeth! 

No, sorry, LOs new bedroom is next door to his brothers..

Ok will post our routine over the weekend. I don't think the daytime is affecting his NWs but always useful to have your thoughts. I'm generally doing a short nap in the morning and waking him hen a longer nap in the afternoon as if I don't wake him the day gets quite long!

Second night of training went ok so hoping for some improvement soon 

[Atomic1010]

Ok here is our routine. Most days are fairly similar...

6.45 awake
9.50-10.50 nap
3 - 4 nap
7.10 Asleep

Sometimes he will nap an extra half an hour in the afternoon.

What Awake time before BT is good for a 9-10 month old baby as I'm wondering if this is something I need to adjust now?

[trimbler]

Glad second night of st went ok, now was night 3?

I can't really give you A times for 9-10mo old as there's such a range, depending on their overall sleep needs and preference for long/short A times, as well as whether they're having  a long first A time and long morning nap, or a slightly UT first nap in order to get a longer pm nap. Just wondered how you came to the routine you're on now? In particular how you decided on the second A time? Did he struggle to settle any earlier? It does seem quite a long second A to me, given that you're waking him from the morning nap, so I can't help wondering whether the 1/1.5h naps may actually be a bit OT - wdyt? On the other hand he may just be on the LSN side of things, in which case capping the morning nap a bit more might help you to bring the afternoon nap a bit earlier and also get it longer. Which in turn might help him get to BT a bit more restored and enable him to have better nights...maybe! I personally found with DS in particular that he needed a nice long pm nap and then a long A to BT, in order to have a decent night. Do you think yours might like that kind of rhythm? Or do you feel he prefers his longest A times in the morning? Just trying to come at this from different angles in the hope that we might stumble upon something that works

[Atomic1010]

Hello!good questions 

I found that if I didnt wake him from his morning nap The afternoon nap was starting to happen later and later as he seems to be able to do a good A time between naps now, which didn't fit well with me having to collect his brother from nursery and consequently LOs bedtime was getting later. I think Kellyjs suggested he was heading towards one nap and she sent me a link about the transition. From reading this I then decided to go short am nap long pm nap, as LO was also struggling to go down for his Pm nap after a long am nap.

It seems to suit him and it's been a few weeks since I let him sleep in the morning til he wakes or beyond 11am. It generally only happens after a very rough night or early wake up. I don't think I am brave enough to try it and then hope for a short pm nap.

But I was asking about a times as I'm wondering whether he would benefit from a longer a time before bedtime so it's interesting to hear that worked for your son. I was wondering if that might help him settle for bed better and with the nights.

Night 3 was ok. He woke alot after 3am though and I think his teeth were making him uncomfortable. I stuck to my plan and only fed twice, moving feeds later each night, and did the shhh pat on him all other times. I'm worried that I might be shh'ing him for too long but it's hard to see in the dark when he is going to sleep so I need to be careful on that.

How long should it take for this training to work? I think I read in Tracey's book it could be two weeks but when I was looking again today couldn't see that...

[trimbler]

Grr to those teeth!

I wasn't very brave when making changes to nap routines, so could only ever bring myself to shave 5mins off that morning nap at a time, but if you're thinking a longer A to BT could help, you might feel braver than I did and make a bigger jump Just bear in mind that after a shorter morning nap he'll need a shorter A, which could bring the afternoon nap forward quite a bit.

I really wish I could say how long this will take, I think you're doing incredibly well given all you've had to contend with, but really it will depend on all these other things, eg teething how about, rather than thinking about how long it will take to 'work', giving yourself a week or two and then looking for improvements. I think if you can see some progress, that will be the encouragement you need to keep going?

[Atomic1010]

Thanks yes that's a good idea and I am keeping a diary. Anyway I don't think any improvement is going to happen in the next few days as LOs other too this just about to break through. He woke every hour last night!  Hopefully once this is through I might get a decent shot at it. I was wondering if Daddy did the ST over one weekend, when things do settle with teeth, it might make things happen quicker?

[Atomic1010]

Ok I need help. I'm beginning to think I am doing something wrong....

For the second night in a row he has been waking every hour. The good news is that once he cries all I do (apart from the 2 times I have decided to feed him, soon to be one then none) is put my hand on him, say a couple of words and he rolls over and goes back to sleep. It happens quicker than it used to.

Now he does have a tooth almost through so it could be he is waking through discomfort although giving him ibuprofen before bed and during the night seems to make no difference.

I am wondering if I am becoming a prop? But then I'm doing what it says in the book to do. Perhaps I shouldn't touch him at all when he wakes and just go straight on to pick up put down?

Also at bedtime it takes him 20mins of crying before he drops off. This isn't a new thing, but I sit by the cot if he gets very upset and comfort him with shh pat if he will let me. If he isn't that upset I sit out of sight and leave the room when he has fallen asleep.  Perhaps when he gets upset I should go to pick up put down? Is sitting by the cot making things worse?

Please help I'm worried we are going backwards 

[trimbler]

(((Hugs))) actually that sounds great to me - I mean, I know it's not great to be woken every hour (!) but the fact that he's able to get back to sleep so quickly with so little input from you is brilliant and definitely progress, right? If he has a tooth about to cut he 's likely waking from discomfort, which could also explain the struggles to get to sleep at BT. Tbh it sounds to me like you're doing really well, it's minimal input from you and he's likely struggling with his sore gums so IMO probably just what he needs right now. Perhaps when those teeth are through and you know he's not in discomfort any more, you can start to reduce your input further. One way to do that would be to hang back a little longer before helping; another way would be to just say your words without any physical contact. And then it may come down to the daytime routine more than your methods for helping him resettle in the night - perhaps he's taking longer to settle at BT because he's UT and needs the last A time stretching, or else he's having too long an A time after just an hour's nap? How does it feel to you? How is he during the day - does he seem really tired or fairly well rested and happy? Did you try capping the morning nap a bit more, at all? I wouldn't bother picking up now unless he's really upset and won't calm any other way, it seems you're good at calming him in the cot so there'd be little point in doing that now. Sorry this is so rambled, not finding much time to come on here this week so it's all coming out in a jumble I'm afraid!

[Atomic1010]

Thanks trimbler really appreciate any advice. Well his tooth is through - but he has a stinking cold so another rough night and more rocking to sleep and feeding to sleep than I would have liked but he just couldn't settle as was uncomfortable. Then we had a 2.5hr long NW. Don't k kW why as he must have been shattered. Just hoping this will be short lived so we can get back on track and I can follow your suggestions!

[trimbler]

Oh no (((hugs))) poor him, poor all of you! Hope he gets better soon

[Atomic1010]

Hi not posted in a while as no further forward really :-(

LO got rid of his cold at the end of last week and I started sleep training again in the day (as had been breastfeeding to sleep at naps) and night.  He's not happy about the change at nap time but settling was getting easier and there was no change at night. However, last night he had a v high temperature and was crying loads so we both got little sleep. He seems wide awake today but I am not! I'm hoping as he is bright eyed this morning it's a minor thing again so we can carry on working on the nights.

I go back to work in 8 weeks so hope to see some improvement soon otherwise I'm going to be asleep at my desk most of the time!!

[trimbler]

Oh dear how frustrating, he always seems to be getting some illness or teething, doesn't he Well done on the ST, just stay consistent with it whenever you can I do remember worrying loads about going back to work when DS was 11mo as his sleep wasn't great either, but somehow it seemed to fall into place right beforehand, so I really hope the same happens to you...otherwise, lots of coffee Which is actually what I'm doing right now

Don't forgot to keep posting your routine whenever you can, in case there are tweaks to be made which might help with the nights.