Author Topic: 4-month old FREAKING OUT with shush-pat: help!  (Read 3703 times)

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Offline MomofCharlie

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4-month old FREAKING OUT with shush-pat: help!
« on: August 10, 2007, 16:38:48 pm »
I have a baby just under 4 months. I got into the habit of having him fall asleep in my arms. Everyone told me not to, and Tracy's book says not to. So I've been trying to use shush-pat to get us out of the habit for the past 2 days. I'm terribly frustrated, because what used to take me 20 minutes to get him to sleep and put him in his crib, has now taken me over an hour of him screaming, successively louder and as I get nearer to the crib. We never had crib issues before. We are on a 3 hour EASY, he sleeps from 9 pm to 6 am every night, with no problem at all going to bed for the night because he's so drowsy at his last feeding. I'm at my wit's end, and questioning why I'm trying to make this change at all. Please help me.
« Last Edit: August 11, 2007, 00:56:19 am by MomofCharlie »

Offline holdenlouis

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Re: Help!
« Reply #1 on: August 10, 2007, 16:48:26 pm »
We started bw when my ds was 4 mo. old. I am pretty sure you should move to a 4 hr. easy. We actually went to 3.5 then 4 gradually. We also did pu/pd. Just some thoughts I'm sure someone else can help you out more. You might want to post your routine too. Big hugs and stick it out, it takes time but it is well worth it. Welcome to bw!! It is a great place!
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Offline MomofCharlie

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Re: Help!
« Reply #2 on: August 10, 2007, 16:52:32 pm »
Thanks. Will post routine when I have time. Doesn't help when my mother just came over, I told her what I've been doing (to answer her "What are you doing to the baby?"), and she tells me "Why don't you just stop trying to put him to sleep?

AGH!!

Offline MomofCharlie

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Re: Help!
« Reply #3 on: August 11, 2007, 00:42:11 am »
OK, our standard routine is:

6 am: wake, diaper, feed
6:25 to 7: activity
7 to 9: nap
9: wake, diaper, feed
9:25 to 11: activity
11 to 12: nap (usually 20 min), or attempt at nap, then a bit of activity til he's hungry
12: diaper, feed
12:25 to 2: activity
2 to 3: nap (usually 20 min), or attempt at nap, then a bit of activity til he's hungry
3: diaper, feed

and so forth, til his 6th feeding at 9 pm, then he goes right to sleep with no problem at all. He sleeps til 4, at which time he fusses for his paci, then goes right back to sleep til about 6 am.

We've been on this routine (give or take half an hour some days) since his birth.

So should I be moving to a four-hour EASY?? How can I get him to a)  have longer napa; and b) fall asleep for naps on his own? He's been falling asleep in my arms, on the rocking chair in his room, after a good wind-down. I then place him in his crib: sometimes he stays asleep, sometimes he jolts awake, so then I have been picking him up again and rocking to sleep again.

I've been trying shush-pat for 2 days: can anyone give me an example of their nap-time routine so I can see what I'm doing wrong, because he's freaking out every time, even when I just change my hold on him to be able to put him in his crib, which he never did before... Thanks in advance.

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Re: 4-month old FREAKING OUT with shush-pat: help!
« Reply #4 on: August 11, 2007, 19:25:27 pm »
"Everyone told me not to" :) i love this. i can't tell you how many times i've been told to just let my daughter cry it out. you do what's best for you and your LO! you needed to get through the rough spots so that you could all sleep and you're here now to go down a different path. you can make it work, i know you can!

the first thing that jumps out at me when i look at your schedule is that your son is going to sleep awfully late. their day should really be no longer than 12 or 13 hours at that age. if he wakes at 6AM, he should be going to bed between 6 and 7PM. have a look at the sample schedules on this page:

https://babywhispererforums.com/index.php?topic=63161.0

and then start working on bringing his bedtime forward a half an hour at a time. don't worry about the naps yet. they will fall into place when he is more rested. i suspect that he's overtired and the more night sleep he gets the better rested he'll be to handle daytime naps. since he's almost 4 months, try switching him to the 3.5 hour EASY. when that's going well, move up to the 4 hour routine especially if he's bottlefed (if he's breastfed he may not be able to do the 4 hours but some can!)
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Offline MomofCharlie

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Re: 4-month old FREAKING OUT with shush-pat: help!
« Reply #5 on: August 11, 2007, 20:35:52 pm »
Wow! Thanks so much! For the support and the advice. He's been sleep deprived, then, hasn't he?

I'll work on the night sleep first, then deal with naps, if they haven't sorted themselves out. Once I get to that, do you suggest working on length of naps, or breaking us both of rocking him to sleep first?


Offline gleek

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Re: 4-month old FREAKING OUT with shush-pat: help!
« Reply #6 on: August 11, 2007, 21:31:17 pm »
personally, i worked on length of sleep first. i used to bounce my LO to sleep, so i was in the same boat. once i got the sleep patterns established, i worked on bouncing her less and less and putting her down awake but relaxed. it took a while but now she is sleeping independently more or less. some days she needs more help relaxing than others. like today, she has a little fever (i suspect that she's teething) so she needed more help getting to sleep than most days. i actually had to swaddle both arms in the last two naps and she has been sleeping with only one arm out for at least two weeks now! some days she just needs more attention than others.
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Re: 4-month old FREAKING OUT with shush-pat: help!
« Reply #7 on: August 12, 2007, 03:35:36 am »
Thanks so much for this... good to know that I'm not alone. One question, though... to move his bedtime earlier, do I just put him to bed right after his 7 pm feeding, or a short A time after that feeding?

From reading other posts, I also think I've been giving him way too much action during his A times... I'll have to look at the A posts to see what's more appropriate for his age. Will have to get my DH to calm down a bit... he likes to really get our LO excited, and I see that excitement spill over into our wind-down times. Legs and arms kicking around, eyes wide open, all happy and excited. Which is cute, but no good for getting naps out of him!!

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Re: 4-month old FREAKING OUT with shush-pat: help!
« Reply #8 on: August 12, 2007, 10:55:51 am »
i put DD straight down after her 7pm feed. i feed her out in the living room with the lights low. when she's done, i burp her, pick her up and we say good night to everything in the apartment :) then 'night to daddy. then into her bedroom for swaddle, lullabies, snuggle, and bed.
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Re: 4-month old FREAKING OUT with shush-pat: help!
« Reply #9 on: August 12, 2007, 14:58:30 pm »
Well, I just put my BB to bed for his second nap of the day, with substantially less fuss than the past few days. He got much more sleep last night, didn't rouse for his paci til 5:30, at which time I let him fuss it out for 3-4 minutes, then he went back to sleep til 6. His first nap is always a breeze, as he pretty much goes right back to sleep shortly after eating. But I end up with some extra time after he wakes up (usually has a good hour and a half) and when he's going to eat next. That's another issue, though. Anyone else get this weird extra time when a baby wakes up early from a nap? Ihave a feeling it'll happen more and more in the coming weeks, as we sort out these sleep issues...

We tried less stimulation, also, this morning, which is hard to do. My DH has so much fun playing with our BB that I'll have to work on both of them to cut back the excitement! I think I'm going to stay home as much as possible this coming week to get these new elements to our routine in place properly.


Offline NewMomVA

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Re: 4-month old FREAKING OUT with shush-pat: help!
« Reply #10 on: August 13, 2007, 02:16:14 am »
I'm new to this site but my situation is quite similar to yours.  My daughter is 3 1/2 months and always napped on my lap.  I discovered BW about 2 weeks ago.  We are currently working on 3.5 and sometimes 4 hour EASY.  Only this past week have I been successful with afternoon naps.  I have to get her ready before she's overtired and upset.  I think we gave her too much stimulation & she was way overtired.  So for naps I swaddle her and hold her quietly in a chair for 5 minutes.  I usually sing softly then put her down and shush/pat (mostly shush).  If I get her at the right time it is taking 15-20 minutes to fall asleep and now she naps for almost 2 hours!  I tried pu/pd a couple of times but my back really hurt so now I just stay with her and shush until she falls asleep.  Best of luck!  I'm reading a book about babies' sleep habits.  Around 3-4 months their nervous systems mature more to promote easier and better sleep.

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Re: 4-month old FREAKING OUT with shush-pat: help!
« Reply #11 on: August 14, 2007, 19:22:57 pm »
Good to know I'm not alone, NewMomVA! Your situation sounds identical to mine. In hindsight, I was overzealous about making sure my little guy was getting stimulated (because, of course, that'll get him into Harvard ;), and didn't realize I was overstimulating him during his activity time. Now that I look at photos of him the past weeks, he looks tired. No wonder! Short naps or no naps sometimes, with all that activity: the little guy was zonked!! He's going on an hour and a half this nap! We've had generally two good naps (an hour or a bit more) and two shorter ones (30 to 45 min), since we started, and he's also going to bed earlier, which is great for him, and for me! Still wakes up at 6 am, even though bedtime is earlier.

Does anyone's LO cry as they fall asleep? 9 times out of 10, my BB will start to scream and cry (real tears) as he's nodding off, so it wakes him. That's what is taking him so long to fall asleep. Sound familiar to anyone? Does anyone know why he does this?


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Re: 4-month old FREAKING OUT with shush-pat: help!
« Reply #12 on: August 14, 2007, 19:38:00 pm »
Momofcharlie.
what sort of cry is it?some have a mantra cry which this doesn't sound like.is he doing anything else like bringing his knees to his chest,biting on his hand etc.
could be that although he is napping better he may need to nap a little earlier?whats your routine at the moment
Andrea
PS love the pic :-* :-*

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Re: 4-month old FREAKING OUT with shush-pat: help!
« Reply #13 on: August 14, 2007, 22:22:12 pm »
Not sure how to describe it. Just handed him off to my DH after about 15 minutes of it. It happens as he begins to nod off (still in my arms; I'm not yet putting him in crib awake).
If I hold him cradle style, he arches his back, grabs at his face, and lets five or six sort of short cough cries, then big wails, mouth open, face red, eyes scrunched closed. When I put him over my shoulder, it's like he's trying to climb up me with his legs, no more of the cough cries, but the big wails again. Before he calms down, he'll cry into my shoulder and it's almost like he's trying to talk with his mouth full. Kind of funny, and it tickles. I'll post our new routine later... must go help my DH...

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Re: 4-month old FREAKING OUT with shush-pat: help!
« Reply #14 on: August 15, 2007, 02:47:50 am »
OK, I'm back. BB is sleeping well now... skipped last nap of the day before final feeding. oh well.

Andrea, you'd asked about our routine... our NEW routine these past few days, now that I'm getting my BB to sleep more and doing wind-down before nap time, looks like this:

6 am: wake, bf
6:30 to 7: quiet play
7 to 8:30: nap
8:30 to 9: quiet play
9: bf
9:30 to 10:30: activity: half an hour of "big" play, followed by half an hour of more quiet play
10:30 to 10:45 or 11: wind-down
12:30: wake, bf
1pm to 2:30: activity: usually an outing of some sort (errands)
2:30 to 2:45: wind-down
2:45 to 4: nap, or attempt at nap; if nap is short, follow it by quiet play
4: bf
4:30 to 5:30: activity: half an hour of "big" play, followed by half an hour of more quiet play
5:30 to 6:30: nap, or attempt at nap; if nap is short, follow it by quiet play
7: bf
7:30 to 7:45: wind-down, if needed
7:45: to bed for the night

These times are approximate. If everything happens a bit earlier (ie:he got hungry earlier), meaning he's fed around 6, I do a dream feed around 10 pm.

Not sure if the cry I described in my last post makes any sense to anyone... Not really sure what everyone means by a mantra cry. I know what Tracy's definition is in the book, but I don't really know what it is or how to recognize it or what it means...